Cue & A - Bonus Episode - Fei Yu, Music Supervisor and Music Editor.

Unfortunately Cris is under the weather and unable to do our normal format episode. This week, I sit down with Fei Yu, Music supervisor and Music Editor and talk about a recent project (Blades of the Guardians #bladesoftheguardians ) we worked on together and my thoughts on the current AI trend.


Blades of the Guardians Trailer:
https://youtu.be/VD4vT41lRYc?si=Lsguxvo9OShI8zwN

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Hey everybody, no new episode of uh QA Composers Unplugged today because Chris is unfortunately under the weather with Strep. So um here's hoping he feels better so we can get back. In the meantime, here is a bonus episode recorded a few, maybe about a month ago, with Faye Yu, a music supervisor and music editor that I've worked with plenty of times. And this uh episode, she actually conducts the uh questions. So um hope you enjoy. Thanks. Welcome to a bonus episode of QA Composers Unplugged. Today we have Faye Yu here as a guest. Um, she is a music supervisor and music editor that I've worked with many a times on films and games. How are you doing, Faye?

SPEAKER_01 0:53

I'm doing great. It's just like we talked about this yesterday through the fall.

SPEAKER_00 0:59

Yeah, so do you wanna so Faye? Since Faye is our guest, I'm gonna put her in charge of the first couple questions.

SPEAKER_02 1:08

Yeah, so we actually just did a movie together, uh Blades of the Guardians.

SPEAKER_00 1:14

Blades of the Guardians, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:16

And uh it did really well in China and also worldwide. And uh we did there there's a lot of like combat thing and also a lot of like fighting, a lot of action, action music, something like that. So I do want to talk a little bit like you know, like when you start with some of the thing like that, then how you you know, like how you started to having your ideas and make it, you know, like not always like the the constant, yeah, like a constantly driven and non-stop and makes you feel tired for which can very be very exhausting. Yeah. Um because actually we do have in one of the comments uh from the previous music, which director is not really happy with because of the once you start it with drum, and you cannot stop at all. Right. Um but you want to have the impact, that kind of feeling for everything, and that's some of the skills.

SPEAKER_00 2:20

Yeah, I mean I I know uh in this film there is a lot of sound effects during the the action sequences, the sword fighting, the hitting, um, and they're and they're very pronounced, and I believe that was an intention for this film. So when writing for it, I you know, I think it it it happens with every film. You shouldn't you need to take that into consideration.

SPEAKER_03 2:40

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:41

And it happened that the fight sequences in this film were actually I don't know if they were purposely done to a tempo, but they fit perfectly to music tracks. Yes. So when writing it, you I uh tended to let the the the clashes of the of the swords and the hits uh uh be part of the music or be the music with with you know odd syncopated hits here and there with tycos and other percussion percussive elements, and sometimes with an underlying ambient tension. Yes. Um and then in certain parts of the fight when something it turns tides, you come in more with the music and more percussion, and then once the action starts again, you know, you sort of let the the sound effect speak for itself.

SPEAKER_04 3:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:32

So and I th I I thought um the idea of having the percussion, I'm sorry, the fighting sounds um in that certain tempo. Like I don't know if that was on purpose by the director, um, but it worked so wonderfully. Yeah, yeah, you know, it actually helped. Um and and it also breaks up the the intensity of the music because that can definitely grate on you during uh five-minute action sequence, you know, because you keep on you know, you start off intense, you don't have much left to go. No, you know, once the fight goes on and on. By the time you get to the end, it's just a a wall of noise if you have to keep on making it intense. So leaving backing off early is I think is the way to go with with these type of action sequences.

SPEAKER_02 4:22

Yeah. And also there's a lot of dialogue in between.

SPEAKER_00 4:27

Yeah, you have to let that leave room for that. Yeah, because I notice a lot of times the entire track will come down. Yeah. Rather than massaging the music, yeah, you know, it's better to, as the composer, abduct during those moments and not play through them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

And also we mentioned about the dynamics in between as well. It's also super important. And also the groove is one thing, like really.

SPEAKER_00 4:56

Right. I mean, I think the the I mean the groove is set, you know. I mean, you have the tempo, but you have to have forward momentum, and that all depends on how you add the rhythm to the the sound effects and the and the and the sword fighting. Um because there's there's laid back rhythms and then there's forward momentum rhythms. Um so it's it's how you apply those rhythms to keep it moving forward and not feel stagnant.

SPEAKER_02 5:23

Yeah. And I guess it's Star From, actually not not exactly Star From the Crouching Tiger, Heathen Dragon, but because they use a lot of taiko and Chinese drum, right? Big traditional drums in there um for the bamboo fighting thing or whatever things. So that's why everybody started to use the drums. Right, those elements, yeah, those elements into their fighting thing, especially for the Chinese and that kind of type of movie. But they really noticed once they started the you know, the pattern. It does make it more intense, that's for sure. Yeah, but it's just so hard for them to stop that pattern.

SPEAKER_00 6:10

Right, and I think that's where with with the Blades of the Guardians, I think that's when introducing the traditional orchestr orchestral elements of it can take over some of the the the driving rhythmic aspects of the scene rather than constantly relying on the percussion. You can have you know the low strings brass doing stabs, you know. So I think blending the traditional instruments into that along with Chinese instruments helps break it up but keeps it going.

SPEAKER_02 6:37

Yes, exactly. So it's kind of like from the whatever the melody side or the orchestration side, it's just like taking over back and forth.

SPEAKER_00 6:45

Right, exactly.

SPEAKER_02 6:46

Yeah, it's just trying to shape it more like a picture-wise. Right, exactly. So giving some different colors, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:52

Essentially, what the job is to do is score to the picture.

SPEAKER_02 6:55

And especially because for that thing, we having Jet Lee in there.

SPEAKER_00 7:00

So we do want to there has to be some weight to it. Yeah, of course, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:06

And also we mentioned about one of the other fighting saying that uh uh we having the people, I mean the the younger character, the actor saying, and we you end up using Swana for Right, wait, wait, what scene are you talking about the beginning of that scene? The actually not the beginning, but for the fire fighting.

SPEAKER_00 7:30

Oh, oh, that that scene, right, right. Oh, right. That one was an interesting cuge. Should I bring it up? Yes, yes. Back um with headphones. Um we have the scene uh Faye was talking about. I'm going to play it. And did you want to preface the scene with anything other than the this is the seat, this is not the final final, so it doesn't have the live Suno. How'd he say Suno? Suano What Exactly. What's the instrument? What was a live instrument you recorded for this?

SPEAKER_02 8:04

Swana.

SPEAKER_00 8:05

Sona.

SPEAKER_02 8:07

Suno, Swana. Suno.

SPEAKER_00 8:11

Sorry.

SPEAKER_02 8:12

Yeah, Swana.

SPEAKER_00 10:29

So, yeah, so the Swana did a heck of a lot better job than well not heck of a better job, but sounded way better than the floor. It's just the flute.

SPEAKER_01 10:39

It's just sounds more different.

SPEAKER_00 10:40

It's raw, it's nasally, yeah, yeah. Uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_02 10:45

Yeah. Yes, we because we we mentioned about it said we want to have some something fun.

SPEAKER_00 10:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

For this for this.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

Right, right. That's where the the heavy metal stuff came in.

SPEAKER_02 10:55

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 10:55

Right.

SPEAKER_02 10:56

Um I think the sauna fits the cue a lot better than the and because I I mentioned that uh the movie is gonna be released during our spring festival time.

SPEAKER_00 11:07

Right, right.

SPEAKER_02 11:08

And we're always using this traditional Chinese instrument, you know, for celebrating.

SPEAKER_00 11:13

Right. Oh, really? Is it that's the uh the chosen instrument?

SPEAKER_02 11:18

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 11:18

Oh, I did not know that.

SPEAKER_02 11:20

Yes, and so that's why we were thinking about yes, we want to try something, you know, like more different.

SPEAKER_00 11:27

Right, right.

SPEAKER_02 11:28

And I was a little bit afraid that our director won't accept it.

SPEAKER_00 11:32

Really?

SPEAKER_02 11:33

And because he he he is also you know a little bit afraid, is that too much, you know, like is is we bring too much color to the character. But at the very at the very end, like everybody just thinking about, you know, like is just having some fun.

SPEAKER_04 11:49

Right.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

And so we decided, and but we do have the option one and option two, one with the bamboo flute.

SPEAKER_00 11:56

Right, right, right.

SPEAKER_02 11:57

And the other one with sonat.

SPEAKER_00 11:58

But the bamboo flute might probably was too soft, right? I don't remember hearing that.

SPEAKER_02 12:02

It's just like an elegant way, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:04

Yeah, no, this one definitely called for. Now, is that I don't obviously when I wrote the part, I wasn't writing for that instrument. Was the range okay for that instrument? Like that's right within its range, yes.

SPEAKER_02 12:16

But we do, we do try some different ways, like different, you know, like improv things.

SPEAKER_04 12:21

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:22

And especially I also bring the Gujong player, yes, and also Peapa player. Okay. And so three of that instrument were together, and you know, like they all try in their different way how to shape the sound, but just you know, bring some authentic and bring some Eastern Chinese like flavor to the cue. Right. But at the same time, because there is so many again, we we always talk about this, like there's just so many fighting parts for this movie, and some of that is more serious, and some of that is you know, final fighting combat thing, but in this part, because it's around Rio 3, so it's kind of in the middle of the movie.

SPEAKER_00 13:06

Yeah, so it's neither setup or final.

SPEAKER_02 13:10

Yes, yes, and so that's why we want to bring some of the you know joy.

SPEAKER_00 13:15

Right. There's gotta be fun parts to it.

SPEAKER_02 13:18

Exactly, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

I mean, all kung fu is fun.

SPEAKER_02 13:20

Exactly. And so they you know, they show off and for all of this cool parts, and I was just thinking about, you know, it's just having some of the moments and having some of the parts that just really, you know, brings out for everything. Just highlighting this thing a little bit. Yeah, and that's why we finally decided, okay, we're gonna use in Swana. Yeah, that's I mentioned to you that's the Chinese trumpet. Oh, is it? Is it is that yes, right, right. But it's just like I I I'm gonna show you that picture that um she brings so many uh different kinds of shape for Swana. So each one is different key.

SPEAKER_00 14:03

Oh, there's different lengths and stuff. Exactly, exactly.

SPEAKER_02 14:06

Some of that is you know more higher pitch.

SPEAKER_00 14:10

Are there not there's there's holes on it, yes, for note changing, but it sticks to a certain key.

SPEAKER_02 14:17

Yes. And so there's all of the different kinds of keys, and she just brings all of the sort of in her pack, and then just bring it to the studio, and we we just trying some of the you know different keys and also different kind of things, but because you already wrote the melody in there, and we just you know, trying to she is my I mean the player is really awesome, and she just trying to interpret a little bit in the slang.

SPEAKER_00 14:47

To the to the instrument, yeah, yeah, that makes sense, of course.

SPEAKER_02 14:50

Yes, yeah, but that's definitely one of the fun parts that we want to. That's also one of the things really important for the Kung Fu movie, that you need to define something like sometimes you want it to be more serious, and sometimes you just want to have a little bit more joy. You cannot be having the combat music, serious music. I mean, all with the bass.

SPEAKER_00 15:12

Well, this this definitely wouldn't have been a good spot for normal action because they're almost on the same side, yeah. You know, yeah, so it's like having this uh type of music behind it to make it more fun, I think is is the smart way to go for sure.

SPEAKER_02 15:32

Yeah, so that's why at the very beginning we always thinking about okay, does the rock and roll that kind of style, is it gonna be too much?

SPEAKER_00 15:40

Or but I think it's that's a nice balance of the guitar and the traditional instruments. Yeah, but until you get to the end where the where the whole drum beat comes in.

SPEAKER_02 15:52

Exactly. But we do having a lot of fun for for doing this project in a really short time.

SPEAKER_00 15:58

Yeah, that was it was quick.

SPEAKER_02 16:00

One and a half one and a half weeks, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:02

Weeks to uh write the uh action music.

SPEAKER_02 16:05

Yeah, yeah, and just no problem, no problem. And just few days for for the mixing and like of course I don't want to take all the credit for the additional music.

SPEAKER_00 16:15

We have Stuart Michael Thomas and Stephen Thumb.

SPEAKER_03 16:20

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 16:21

Um we all came in and uh lifted a heavy load and got it done.

SPEAKER_02 16:24

Yeah, yeah, exactly. At the very last minute.

SPEAKER_00 16:27

Very, very last minute. But happy to do it. Yeah, but I wish I could have done the whole film.

SPEAKER_02 16:34

It turns out really well in the world.

SPEAKER_00 16:37

So it will or it is going to be released or it is released here in the US.

SPEAKER_02 16:41

It's already released in here. Really? Yes.

SPEAKER_00 16:44

On streaming or Select Theaters?

SPEAKER_02 16:46

No, Select Theaters.

SPEAKER_00 16:47

Uh why are they oh oh yes? So is the other one in Select Theaters per Aspora. But no theaters near here.

SPEAKER_02 16:55

No.

SPEAKER_00 16:56

No, they're they're they're down where I was with the baseball games. What's that?

SPEAKER_02 17:02

It's during the spring festival time, which is around February.

SPEAKER_00 17:07

Right, but they're not they don't put it in theaters. I don't know who's whose choice it is. I don't know if if the theaters are the ones that bid on or pay. I have no idea how it works. Um, but yeah, every like all the smaller movies, not that this is small, but other smaller movies I've done. They're never in like within, I mean, they're within driving distance, but it's like, okay, you gotta pack up for the day.

SPEAKER_02 17:30

Yeah, that's the same, like, really, you know, like culture exchange is really important.

SPEAKER_00 17:36

Yeah, yeah, that's true.

SPEAKER_02 17:37

And we really want to, that's why for the even because kung fu movie, you know, like we're always thinking about it's gonna be the breakthrough for that. And we really want, you know, this kind of rara, and also this kind of thing. This movie so far is ranking number two for the Kung Fu movie around the world. And we just hopefully it will be even getting better. Yeah. I really want, you know, like more people can see this type of, you know, we don't call it Chinese movie, but it's we see this as, you know, like international.

SPEAKER_00 18:13

Right. It definitely is. I mean, uh you you just have the potential audiences who have issues reading subtitles.

SPEAKER_02 18:21

Yeah. You know, that I I I was just really happy because when I show this movie to you guys and you know, everybody's really excited.

SPEAKER_00 18:30

It's looks beautiful. I mean, it is just so much fun. I mean, the other two. Both all three films, all China three Chinese films I worked on are just amazingly shot. I always it is just amazing. So just looking at it, I'm like, yeah, work on it.

SPEAKER_02 18:44

Yeah, I I was just also really, you know, proud. Yeah, yeah, to to show this to everyone. For me, it's really like a culture exchange things. Right. We share different ideas and we, you know, share our own culture things, and we just explain and our different ideas. Right. And we all love, you know, what we bring it out. For I I still remember for the uh decoded um that you bring the sound.

SPEAKER_00 19:12

Right, the more of the traditional sound to the story.

SPEAKER_02 19:16

And it's you know, like it's really cool, and we we also bring some of the you know the the coding sound.

SPEAKER_00 19:24

Oh, right, yeah, the sort of math behind the music type of stuff.

SPEAKER_02 19:28

Exactly. Like I I love all of these ideas, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:31

It makes the makes the music interesting and ties it in even better.

SPEAKER_02 19:35

Exactly. And that's the part, you know, I don't think AI can replace it. Because, you know, like all of this kind of ideas when we work together, and you know, like based on all of your more than 20 years experience, that's all you know comes out.

SPEAKER_00 19:57

Right. And I mean, at the base of it, AI is just going to put together what is out there already. It's just gonna what do you what do you what do you call it? Uh aggregate everything. Think it's spitting out something new and it's really not. And um Yeah, I mean, do you really wanna you wanna dive into the hell AI?

SPEAKER_02 20:21

Yeah. And no, I I I do want to, you know, talk a little bit before the AI. Okay. Because you know, there there is a lot of people that, you know, they really worried about it, that their job gonna be, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:38

I first one of the cameras just shut up for some reason. Um okay, we were talking about AI. And what I was gonna say, I think with my knowledge, I haven't first of all, I haven't dove too much into AI. Um, but my with as far as tracks being produced by AI, I think the first industry that's going to be hit the hardest is the advertising industry. Yes and people who do library tracks. Yeah. Um, but I I am very good friends with a composer-songwriter who does tons of library tracks. And the amount of specific revisions he has to do um and the the amount of versions he has to spit out lengthwise, stem-wise, I don't think AI is capable of that yet.

SPEAKER_02 21:40

Um you never know. Yeah, but because do you still remember two years ago when we were doing um decoded? Right, when we needed the sample.

SPEAKER_00 21:52

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:53

And then I used a AI vocal. Yeah. And it's just for temp. And just in the fucking. And I didn't tell you guys it's a real person. Yeah, we couldn't tell. Um, but at the very end I told you guys like it's AI I forgot the software, but yeah, it's singer.

SPEAKER_00 22:10

Now I mean Q Base has uh singer AI now that you can write in melodies and type in words, and it sounds really good for free in well, not free, but I mean it's in the software now. Yeah, and I used it just as a test, and I was like, this is scary. And I think it's great as a tool, but not as a final version. It's great to get your idea across as where you want things. Like if you I think it will like if you hire a singer and play back this, it'll shorten the amount of time between a first version and a final accepted version. It'll give the singer more of an idea. I mean, you don't want to pigeonhole the singer into do it this way. Obviously, you want the singer to add their own inflections and their own ideas, but I think it it helps in that aspect.

SPEAKER_03 23:02

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 23:02

But people who end up using, and I don't know anybody that does yet, but I'm sure there's plenty out there who use it as a final element in their mixes, that to me is frowned upon. I don't think it should be done. I think it should be used as a tool.

SPEAKER_02 23:17

But that that's what we talk about because we want to use, you know, like AI as a tool.

SPEAKER_04 23:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:23

And so we're having the ving-ving situation for everyone, but not just, you know, just totally lean on that thing.

SPEAKER_00 23:32

Right, exactly. Yeah, I mean, the same similar conversations were had 15, 20 years ago is when samples started sounding great.

SPEAKER_03 23:43

That's true.

SPEAKER_00 23:44

And everybody was like, well, the live musicians are gonna be put out of work.

SPEAKER_03 23:47

That's true.

SPEAKER_00 23:48

To an extent, there were a lot, there's a lot of musicians that are put out of work because of the extremely low budget films that can't afford the orchestra. Yes, they want it all in the box, they and and you can get away with um sounding huge. I think the smaller ensemble you use in a film or anything, you need live. Any one instrument of each section of anything that invoke that human feeling. But I think you can get away more with a huge epic score with samples um than a small quaint score. Um, and that's not saying you should do that. I mean, like if the means are there, get some live.

SPEAKER_04 24:31

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 24:31

You know, it doesn't, you know, I don't want to say record overseas, it's cheaper or more affordable. Not cheaper, it's more affordable. But I mean, unfortunately, that's the way it is now.

SPEAKER_04 24:41

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 24:42

Um, but I think the music still deserves some sort of live element. And in the money is tight, get a small string session to overlay yourself.

SPEAKER_02 24:52

We always talk about and we also did that for several for several years. Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_00 24:56

And I think it's I think it's I think that elevates the music.

SPEAKER_02 25:01

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 25:02

Um, and it also keeps musicians, you know, working, you know.

SPEAKER_02 25:07

Also, I like I really enjoy every time we're doing this, you know, recording session together, and it's just we having some of the ideas that suddenly comes.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

Oh, once you hear the live players and yeah, and what they bring. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_02 25:22

And we shape a little bit for the score. And we're just having some of the different ideas. I still remember, I forgot it's maybe it's for Parastra for that movie. And we try, you know, letting them to sit.

SPEAKER_00 25:35

Oh, we changed the that was the seat. This idea for overdubs, yeah. Yes. Uh we sit the first whole first take, sat them in the close chairs. Yeah. The whole um we bring them back a little bit, put them back in the back chairs, yeah, and it layered nicely, beautifully, actually.

SPEAKER_02 25:50

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 25:51

Um, so yeah, coming up with ideas, I I think like that enhances the live aspect you add to the score for sure. Um, I'm not so scared of AI yet as where I am, not where I am, but where the composers are today working. Um why? Well, one we're thinking of stuff. I'm not saying we're reinventing the wheel every time we write a score, but there's a human element behind it. There's an experience behind writing music. You're um I think the AI aspect of it can't pull from the same pool of emotion as a human can. Um, it could probably spit out a version of what a human can write, but I think there is inevitably a connection between a human writing something and an AI writing something. Maybe not everybody can tell, you know. I mean, you see, I mean, videos, yes, AI videos, and I would say maybe 50%, if not higher, think it's real.

SPEAKER_02 27:06

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

So audio is, I think audio is a little bit harder.

SPEAKER_02 27:10

Audio is a little bit harder.

SPEAKER_00 27:11

To to, I mean, but eventually it'll get there. Yes. But I I just think, and I don't know if I'll be able to tell the difference. Um, but I think the back and forth between, at least in in scoring for film or scoring for media, there's a back and forth between the composer and the creator of said uh media, where the music then grows with collaboration. I don't think that's gonna happen by somebody entering a prompt and then modifying the prompt.

SPEAKER_03 27:45

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 27:46

Um I could be wrong, but that's that's how I feel. Um and I just lost my train of thing. I was gonna say something about how much resources it takes, too, for AI um to get it done, which is not good for the environment. Um but as far as the creative side, um I I I also think that directors, writers, creators, whoever is creating the element, they are so true to their art.

SPEAKER_03 28:18

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 28:19

I'm hoping that they would not want to have AI be a part of their work.

SPEAKER_02 28:26

That that's that's true.

SPEAKER_00 28:28

As a final.

SPEAKER_02 28:28

Yes, you know, that that's true, but at the same time, they do, you know, sometimes there is the budget issue.

SPEAKER_00 28:35

Of course.

SPEAKER_02 28:36

And they they never say that you have to use AI, but you know, sometimes they've well, I mean, there yeah, there's people putting out short films now that I mean that look really cool.

SPEAKER_00 28:47

I mean, you could still tell that they're AI. Um but I I I just I think it's it's it's cheating the art. Um, and I think integrity is gonna have to be the thing that stops it from happening. And I'm hoping there's enough of that in humanity still moving forward that um it can be used as a tool and not as a a way out.

SPEAKER_02 29:15

Yeah. Um yeah, I do agree. Like for let's say in this way, for example, when you're composing, and sometimes, for example, like at least for for my side, for example, when attempt the music. And sometimes I do met with the situation that, you know, like I I just I don't know what kind I I mean, I know the direction, I know what kind of music I should put it in there, but it's just you know, like I just I lost my mind that I don't know, you know, from rage score that type of music I should put it to this movie. And I do hope that, for example, if it's like AI tools can help me, you know, like I just type Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:01

What movie has this type of score? And then you use that as a tip. Exactly. Oh, that's just like I mean, that I think is is is you know, just another form of of a Google search.

SPEAKER_02 30:12

Yes, just bring me, you know, more ideas, right? Right.

SPEAKER_00 30:14

Not don't make the idea. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 30:16

Bring me the yeah, bring me some more ideas, and you know, like because I didn't watch, you know, like millions of the movies. Right. Just I just watch, you know, like but you know the sound you want in your head.

SPEAKER_00 30:28

Exactly, exactly. And you want to convey that to the composer.

SPEAKER_02 30:32

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 30:33

How do I do that? Well, you know, help me find that. And I think that AI use in that aspect, I think.

SPEAKER_02 30:40

And I think same from the composer side, you know, like sometimes when you want more ideas, maybe you can also, you know, type some of the keywords.

SPEAKER_00 30:49

I wouldn't even know. Like if I see, like, if when I write and I want to write, oh, I think this would be a great section for like a John Williams type of run or something. Yeah, I don't like I I would it would be the same as if I'd opened up one of his scorebooks. But like, how does he do his runs?

SPEAKER_03 31:06

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 31:07

You know, so I guess it's the same sort of way of thinking is get me to what I want to be able to do faster.

SPEAKER_03 31:17

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 31:19

So that use of AI, I think, would be cool.

SPEAKER_02 31:23

Yeah, because you know, if you everybody just using AI for their final things, then eventually what I think is, you know, everybody gonna be sounds the same.

SPEAKER_00 31:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:37

Because it's all AI generated, and then AI learning from, you know, all of the human beings' work.

SPEAKER_00 31:43

Right.

SPEAKER_02 31:44

As well.

SPEAKER_00 31:45

Yeah, it's but I think the the biggest caveat will be the input from the other creatives on the team, whether it be music editor, director, you know, music supervisor, it's just and that those four minds working together are not gonna be able to, or no, the four minds working together are gonna be able to do what an AI can't do. Yeah, yeah, you know. So and I think when when a film score is put together in the end, it's because and because it works so well, is because of those different minds collaborating. Yes. And I think maybe like you were saying, like the no budget, low budget stuff.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

Yeah, I think gonna be right they feel like they need to rely on that.

SPEAKER_00 32:26

Yes, but I honestly to me that's laziness. I mean, like there are so many composers out there, so many. Yes, you would be able to get somebody to re to write you something original for a low cost. I mean, when I was coming up, I was working for pennies just to get the credits. Yes, you know, so I think using AI to get your score for your AI film, um, I I think it's it's lazy because that's at least one aspect you can get a human to do. And it will sound good because of the quality of samples these days. I mean, there's going to be a step where the humans are affected, I think. Yes. Like because if you're using all samples on something, then yes, live musicians are um but yeah, and using a final score that is AI, I that's that's lazy.

SPEAKER_02 33:15

But I I just think that, you know, it comes to everyone that you know we have to be good enough to be, you know, not be replaced.

SPEAKER_00 33:27

Oh, right, right, right. I think I think part of that is the mental aspect of the relationships.

SPEAKER_04 33:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:37

Um yeah, it just it depends. I mean, I think people who love the art will be good and will continue to get good. You know, they should be learning as they go at every stage of their life. Um and I think humans are always gonna be one step ahead of AI because AI can only learn from humans.

SPEAKER_02 34:03

You know, I don't think, I don't think I mean maybe one day who knows, you know. I hope not.

SPEAKER_00 34:09

You know, if AI learns from humans, humans progress at a rate that I don't think AI can catch.

SPEAKER_02 34:18

If human getting lazy, then you know, like making even more progress. The saying like human beings is like really creative is because you know, like we really try to try more things and try more and different and exactly. But if we learn, for example, I saw one of the reports said, you know, like I'm worried about my kids because you know they're using Dipsy, you they're using Chat GPT every day. Right. And what they're learning is everything is generated by AI. So all of the knowledge that from them is actually provided by AI.

SPEAKER_04 34:59

Right.

SPEAKER_02 35:00

And if, you know, but when we grow up, actually we didn't come from that general.

SPEAKER_00 35:06

No, we had to search for the knowledge and learn the knowledge and study.

SPEAKER_02 35:11

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 35:11

Um, so humans probably will be getting dumber.

SPEAKER_02 35:14

Is still like stay foolish, you know, and then like we eager to learn more. I think that's the way.

SPEAKER_00 35:22

Yeah, and I I think that's going to, you know, it it depends on the audience, and it depends on, you know, because you tell someone a score was all AI, I don't think the average audience is going to know. I I and and that's the scary part. Because the general audience is what pays to go see the movies, pays to buy the merchandise, uh pays to buy the streaming, uh, you know, all that. So and of course a company's gonna, a big, huge company, they're thinking about money.

SPEAKER_03 35:57

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 35:57

So it's like I I think I don't think it's close, but it's going to be tough.

SPEAKER_02 36:06

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 36:07

Um, I think there are elements. Yeah, I I there are elements that I think will save us.

SPEAKER_03 36:15

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 36:16

Um, but it's not gonna be easy. No. Especially when the money with the people who are making decisions are are not creatives and not at all caring about the thing that makes the money.

SPEAKER_02 36:31

Yeah, yeah. So on that note, it it moves me just a few days ago. I went to Disney concert hall and I saw John Williams.

SPEAKER_00 36:42

Oh, lucky, nice.

SPEAKER_02 36:43

94 years old. Oh, right, right.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

Didn't I did you take a picture of her video? Yes, yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 36:48

94 years old, and he's still writing, you know, the next Steve's movie.

SPEAKER_00 36:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:57

I do believe he's the he's still using the pen. Oh, I'm sure the pen and piano, yeah. Exactly. Every single note.

SPEAKER_00 37:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:07

And I think that's the best part, you know, to encourage everyone, especially me. That, you know, like we have to, you know, just try even more harder.

SPEAKER_00 37:18

And just to go back to the roots of how things are done. Yes. Yeah. I mean, I think that, I mean, essentially, with all the projects I write for, that's sort of how it starts.

SPEAKER_03 37:30

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 37:31

Um, because you have to have you have to have a melody and you have to have a chord structure.

SPEAKER_03 37:36

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 37:37

And then you just build everything around that.

SPEAKER_03 37:39

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 37:39

Um I I'm guilty of, you know, having the sounds inspire me sometimes for uh melodies and stuff, uh, which I think is harmless, but I think the melody, regardless of what sound is being used for the melody, whether it be horn, strings, whatever, the melody's got to be good.

SPEAKER_03 38:01

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 38:02

And I think the rawest way to do that is with a single instrument and writing the notes down. Uh I'm lazy, sometimes I don't do that. And there you go. That's a laziness.

SPEAKER_02 38:13

When you're having the meeting, right, right, yeah. And you play the chords all the way there.

SPEAKER_00 38:20

Yeah, so it's it's it, I mean, laziness creeps in with every aspect of the process. And you just have to stay vigilant and you know, stay true to you know how it's how it should be done.

SPEAKER_02 38:34

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 38:35

So I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 38:37

I don't know as well. But I do, I mean, um really because you know, like I want always want to learn new things every day.

SPEAKER_00 38:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:47

And that's why like I try to learn something from Suno. Right, okay, yeah, yeah. And I I learned a lot of things from you guys as well. And it's a what? And I see a lot of things from you know, live musicians, yeah. And they always bring, you know, different kinds of perspectives to the score, and that's the best part. That always remember that you know, when we're having the recording session and we all at the different time zone. Yeah. And sometimes midnight, but everybody is like, you know, just like drinking tens of the coffee, but we still, you know, super excited. Yeah. After so many months, like hardworking, and finally, you know, at the stage, recorded our music.

SPEAKER_04 39:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 39:40

And especially finally it's released in the movie theater. We just, you know, you feel excited.

SPEAKER_00 39:45

I feel the excitement. I mean, this the recording, sometimes like like with recording sessions, uh it's a great moment and process in the whole scheme of things. Um, but it starts off awesome, and then I get anxious about getting it all in.

SPEAKER_03 40:04

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 40:05

Yeah. That that like you then you start cutting, not cutting corners, but you st you're not able to do certain ideas, you sort of have to stick to it. Um, unless, of course, it's a like a paramount production and they're just willing to throw the money at you.

SPEAKER_02 40:19

But last question is, you know, for some of the graduates or for someone that really want to, you know, step in this industry, what tips that you want to give it to them, especially in this period of time with tons of AI technology, like everything, like what you want to give them.

SPEAKER_00 40:41

I think uh, well, if they're graduates of a music school, they're gonna know their music. They're gonna know um, which is a huge tool to have. I'm not saying you need music theory to write music, um, but the knowledge of it definitely helps. Um figure AI out. Um don't use it instead of something, use it with your talent. Yes. Um and never submit anything that is AI. If you do say this is a uh uh, you know, even like with with mock-ups, I mean people know you don't have a you know 60-piece orchestra in your studio and you submit these things for review, they know it's since so I mean I think if you submit something with AI in it, whether it be an AI voice or an AI instrument, um it's just part of the mock-up. I think it's it's fine. Um, but don't let that be the final, you know. Um, and another tip is I mean, Chris and I were talking about this in our in our first episode, is you know, just relationships. Yeah, make relationships with my one thing that I kick myself in the butt for that I wish I did, was I was not against, but my idea was to why do I want why do I want to be friends with other composers in the composer circles when they're all trying to do the same thing I'm doing. Yes, I want to be friends or make relationships with directors and producers, guys that are doing independent films. That didn't work out as well. I mean, a lot of the guys I had good relationships with either quit the industry or other stuff happened to them. Like a lot of the relationships just dwindled. Now, later on in my career, I made friends with a lot of composers. That's true. Um, and then when I started, you know, working with Lauren's team, I met a slew of composers that were working with him on and off. And it's it was one of the best things that has happened to me musically, and I mean it's later on in life, you know. I'm I wasn't I'm not a young composer anymore. So I think making getting a circle of friends of composers, because you feed off each other. Yes, you know, if they're giving 100% on something and you're not, I think witnessing somebody else bust their ass in the same seat you are in is gonna make you do the same. Um and it's just the ideas, the inspiration from each other is is is unmatched. You can't get anywhere else. And you're yes, the field is flooded with composers.

SPEAKER_03 43:29

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 43:30

But it's up to you if if you go somewhere.

SPEAKER_03 43:33

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 43:33

Um so yeah, that's that's one thing I suggest young guys do or young people do if they're coming out of school, is stick because I know you make friends in school that are other composers, stick with those friends. Um, because the circle of friends uh that are composers, you know, I think will lend itself to more relationships. Because if they become friends with uh a AAA composer or something, they get get work. Uh under them, you know, and they could bring you on, or vice versa. You know, I think that's one key aspect that I stress.

SPEAKER_03 44:08

Um help each other.

SPEAKER_00 44:10

Yeah, exactly. My ego got in the way back then where I'm like, I'm gonna do this by myself, I'm gonna struggle and make a living and get gigs. I mean, I worked for a composer early, early on. Um, it wasn't going the way I wanted it to go. Um, so I was gonna go off my own. I did, and um, I I would say obviously I'm successful. I, you know, I made a living out of it, but I wish I had made those relationships earlier on with other composers. Yes, because they're all great guys.

SPEAKER_03 44:40

Yes, they are.

SPEAKER_00 44:41

Um, and I love love talking with and hanging out with the guys that I've met through Lauren. Um, yeah, so I mean, I suggest that.

SPEAKER_04 44:52

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 44:54

So, yeah. We good? That good?

SPEAKER_04 44:56

We good.

SPEAKER_00 44:57

All right, thank you everybody for watching this special episode of QA Co Composers Unplugged with Faye Yu, music supervisor and music editor. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 45:08

Thank you.